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Journey to Reaching $100 profit a day with Native Ads

Discussion in 'Follow Alongs and Online Journeys' started by Flaxy, Jun 26, 2019.

  1. TheDanmit

    TheDanmit Affiliate affiliate

    Well, keep us updated on results of that second campaign. So far it seems that it surely has potential, did you cut back CPC on the first campaign?
  2. CPA Evolution
  3. Graybeard

    Graybeard Well-Known Member affiliate

    • On US traffic I can do financial profiling on valid ISP traffic by location (city, state, zipcode) (70%+- accuracy) from public records.
    • On Global traffic I can detect much known non ISP traffic in real time
    • I can heuristically detect some non-human (bot) traffic in real time and forensically detect additional bot traffic with forged headers (after the fact)

    Before you ask; this is not by using some magic 'tool", free or paid for :D
    It's done with hard earned knowledge and data accumulated by myself and using data accumulated by others who have sourced their data in the public domain.

    I can buy public domain sourced data based on the information that a user gives me -- email, location address, telephone number etc.
    The real problem is in either your traffic or your funnel -- possibly both.
    You can only control your end; the offer that you hand-off the referral to basically only supplies you with binary data (yes|no) and no possible reasons for the why part -- only perhaps subjective or assumed reasons on your part.

    On your own landing pages you can use beacons and statistics -- what I mean by this are image types served, form inputs, setting your own cookies and tracking them. Then by counting and studying your own redirects that are logged on your server.

    Do your own logs agree with the traffic network's counts?
    If they disagree what is the under count?
    Is their count unreasonably inaccurate?
    You tracker may show this if the traffic is recorded more than once on your landing page
    1. the first hit in -- is that being recorded the tracker?
    2. the 302 exit to the tracker (the CTR of the landing page CTA -- the click thru ->again)
    3. and the redirect to the destination (the offer usually?)
    Learn to read and use your own webserver's access logs -- don't just depend on some tracking tool.

    The way I see it: people spend money on web design and traffic without any real effort to incorporate accountability. You cannot prevent most problems before they occur but you should be able to discern what has occurred -- and take actions more based on some known facts rather than blind assumptions.
  4. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    Sure did! Attached the image with this update.

    Seems like experience is everything... You are doing this full time by now I assume?

    Your post is a lot to take in but I try to answer what I understand and reread the rest.

    My tracker differs slightly with the ad network as in I have around $220 spend and the difference between the networks is about $6. Would you say this is significant?

    1. My tracker url is the campaign url on the traffic network.
    2. What do you mean here?
    3. And this one as well?

    Currently researching access logs, what they do and how to use them.

    Update #5

    This weekend was a success! At least for campaign 1. I am going to stop campaign 2 now to focus on campaign 1.

    Campaign #1

    Visits: 289
    Clicks: 72
    Conversions: 1
    Revenue: $25.5
    Cost: $22.55
    Profit: $2.95
    ROI: 13.06%

    Campaign #2

    Visits: 156
    Clicks: 14
    Conversions: 0
    Revenue: $0
    Cost: $14.11
    Profit: -$14.11
    ROI: -100%

    Plan: Open up widget ID and some other adverts in order to get more data before blocking things.
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
  5. clairedivas

    clairedivas Affiliate affiliate

    Native ads have caught my attention lately and that's why I have been experimenting with them for around 2-3 weeks now With this journey I am going to learn more about native ads and gain some knowledge from more experienced members while inspiring beginners as well.
    TORO Advertising likes this.
  6. Graybeard

    Graybeard Well-Known Member affiliate

    No, I meant
    • the gross number of ads served
    • if you do not host the served content you are working blind
    =In other words; if you upload your ad image to a remote server (you do not control) you cannot count your ad image independently.

    The image would be status 200 or 304 in YOUR server log or 403/444 possibly

    Otherwise, a remote server could tell you anything and there is no verification.
  7. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    Why are you quoting me?

    If I read this correctly, they can give you say you received clicks and impressions while not true? Is that what you mean?

    Update #6

    Campaign #1

    Visits: 910 (798 unique) <<<< Why the 100 difference??
    Clicks: 173 (157 unique)
    Conversions: 5 (2 confirmed, 2 on hold, 1 rejected)
    Revenue: $51
    Cost: $74.52
    Profit: -$23.52
    ROI: -31.56%

    Today I have unblocked some of my widgets and ads in order to receive more data and as well target more devices which in return increased my budget spend by a LOT as you can see.

    Waiting to see if I can get the 2 orders on hold to approve by tomorrow which would push me into the green today.

    Anyone know why I got around 100 duplicate clicks and where I can see where they come from?

    Attached Files:

  8. Graybeard

    Graybeard Well-Known Member affiliate

    • I hate to say so --but padding and shaving is very common when you do not have database control, or the opportunity to audit the database and the books, in this man-in-the-middle AM industry.
    • That said; some businesses deal honestly --but it's too damn easy to shave off the top or pad some amount and get away with it.
    When I was a field or inside salesman years ago; we took an order and knew it existed.
    The customer said yes to our ear or signed on the dotted line then we turned in the order to our employer.
    If something went wrong we had the data to either talk with the customer on the phone or visit his home or place of business to confirm the status of the sale --was it delivered or not --hard evidence </case closed>

    I consider everyone suspect doing business on the internet. False claims and erroneous data are not that uncommon. If things don't look right I just walk away. I walk away a lot and sometimes can miss an opportunity. It's really a subjective judgement.

    I can't say why something may work or may not work based on summarized data.
    $6/$220 is only 3% I think that seems reasonable. But what is that error actually?

    total : unique IPs are IPs(traffic) that has requested you ad more than once in a 24hr period.
    that can occur when a person sees the same as twice and clicks and possibly if he refreshes the ad?

    visits to what? your prelanding (funnel) page and the clicks mean the CTR FROM that page of yours?

    $74.52/157 =$0.47 that is what a potential customer cost you (that day).
    $74.52/4 =$18.63 is your cost per customer acquired in the ad campaign (that day) less any other expenses [server, time, misc biz expense] assuming the 'pending' sales complete.
  9. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    1. No idea where that error comes from.. Is it smart to show the same ad to the user more than once a day? If they are interested maybe the chance to convert is bigger?

    2. The visits mean they clicked on the ad and go to my prelander, clicks mean they go from prelander to the offer page. Pending sales take a long time.. any idea why with cod offers? They should get completed the same day no?

    Update #5

    The last 3 days I have been experimenting with targeting more devices like smartphones and the results are.. not so good. Not sure if mobile just performs worse than desktop but it seems so..

    I removed 1 OS version for now and if mobile won't perform again I will stop them altogether. Also reduced the amount of ads from 24 to the best performing 6 to see how that impacts ROI.

    3 day stats:
    Visits: 1856
    Clicks: 420
    Conversions: 0 (3 on hold, 3 declined)
    Revenue: $0
    Cost: $151.66
    Profit: -$151.66
    ROI: -100%

    Overall very discouraging... hopefully today will be better.
  10. Graybeard

    Graybeard Well-Known Member affiliate

    I have used 2 views in a 24/hr period. There is the argument of redundancy in advertising in general. Even intrusive ads and obnoxious ads get remembered (for better or worse) \_(‘ < ‘ )_/

    Unless, you can identify some device to EXCLUDE due to some design shortcoming --what is the point?
    Targeting desktop or mobile makes sense.
    Devise targeting is easy because that is given in the reply headers by the browser.

    If you want more unsophisticated users: Chrome and Edge are your buddies :p
    Flaxy likes this.
  11. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    Chrome is performing decent with a -11% roi over the last period (30 days chosen)
    Firefox suprised me with a 50% roi right now at 224 visits total with a ctr of 110
    Safari also doing well with a 17% roi (1 conversion)

    Chrome mobile is terrible for me with a -73% roi. :(

    Mobile in general was pretty awful the last 3 days where I started it.. Mostly android eating up my budget.

    I'm starting to think weightloss should be sold on desktop mostly.
  12. Graybeard

    Graybeard Well-Known Member affiliate

    Mobile is lots of cheap traffic that is hard to find the right offer for that converts.
    Are you trying to use an offer that is COD with a Tier 2 or 3 GEO?
  13. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    I believe it is a Tier 1 GEO, maybe Tier 2 depending on your criteria.


    As you might have noticed my updates are not daily anymore. This is mostly because I am learning and optimizing the campaign and having more data to update is better in my opinion.

    6 day stats:
    Visits: 4214
    Clicks: 981
    Conversions: 4 (19 on hold, 6 declined)
    Revenue: $102
    Cost: $354.44
    Profit -71.22%

    1. As you can see on the surface level a -71% ROI might seem bad but I am gaining a lot of new conversions who need to be approved. I believe that even if I get only a 50% approval rate on those 19 (I think I will get more) I will be very close to a green campaign overall. I JUST FEEL IT, I AM SO CLOSE TO A BREAKTHROUGH.

    2. The number 1 big thing that changed tripled the amount of conversions I got was..

    .. to turn off day parting. As a beginner promoting cod offers I was turning off my ads every single time the call center in the country would close as well. WHAT A BIG MISTAKE THAT WAS.

    People come home after work and browse their phones and pc all night. Why I ever thought it was a good idea is beyond me. The people at the call center will just call them back when the next work day start. This realization alone tripled my conversions the last 3 days from 0-2 a day to around 6 a day. INSANE.

    3. In the last update I thought mobile was terrible but it seems like I judged too quickly. Removing a certain OS made it a lot better. I am focusing 90% on MOBILE right now.

    Also I am starting to see positive roi appear in my tracker, the data is starting to show which ads are profitable, which widgets are profitable and same for browses and OS.

    4. I fixed the problem with utmsandbox which caused me not to get data from widget id so I can start to remove budget eaters there as well.

    The Plan
    5. At the moment I have 2 landing pages and 4 offers, I am going to focus on only the best one and try to optimize the landing page to turn this campaign GREEN.

    This will be done using the heat map and recordings from Hot Jar. I have already collected some data and plan on using it today.

    6. Furthermore I will keep reducing budget eating ads and widgets/browsers/os.

    That's it! Let me know what you guys think and if this is helpful to follow along.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jul 10, 2019
    litterbitz likes this.
  14. tsc

    tsc Affiliate affiliate

    Things are starting to happen for you mate. Good stuff.
    The only way is UP.
    Flaxy likes this.
  15. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    Certainly true, it is only a matter of when I will succeed not of. :)
  16. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    Update #7

    Because of the conversions on hold and confirming or rejecting several days after I have decided to use the "last 7 day" metric to post updates instead of the daily metric (or else you will only see red and on holds).

    Last 7 day stats:
    Visits: 5966
    Clicks: 1582
    Conversions: 13 (11 on hold, 12 declined)
    Revenue: $331.50
    Cost: $517.43
    Profit -35.93%

    As you can see the campaign is improving at a pretty good rate. This time I have decided to share some other stats as well.


    Ad1: 13.19% roi
    Ad2: -38.51% roi
    Ad3: -7.71% roi
    Ad4: -34.50% roi
    Ad5: 12.30% roi
    Ad6: -100% roi
    Ad7: -100% roi
    Ad8: -100% roi

    These are my current ads that I am using(with many that had 1 x product payout in spent removed), ad 6 still has 2 on hold conversions so that one could turn out to be a winner. Ad7 and 8 might be cut soon if they don't start performing.

    Glad to see some ads performing rather well.


    Land1: -25.16% roi
    Land2: -37.54% roi

    These stats are OK, but I am currently testing 2 more landers based on 1 and 2 but improved with hot jar heat maps to see where clicks are. Then I start to hyperlink images and much clicked words.


    Offer 1: -65% roi
    Offer 2: -65.36 roi
    Offer 3: -43.86% roi
    Offer 4: -6.14% roi

    Seems like we have a winner with offer 4. Offer 3 will be tested still while 1 and 2 will be removed.

    Question: Do you guys know how long cod offers generally run? I'm hoping to be able to break into green and profit for a while before it gets taken down.. wouldn't want to waste all this effort for nothing.

    Let me know your thoughts and what else you would like to see. Is it useful to update this way or would you rather have it more simple?
  17. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    Update #8

    Last 7 day stats:
    Visits: 6834
    Clicks: 2107
    Conversions: 16 (9 on hold, 10 declined)
    Revenue: $408
    Cost: $600.74
    Profit -32.08%

    These are my current statistics which shows a small improvement yet again. I have discovered drill down reports thanks to someone who is more knowledgeable than me and used yesterday to discover a winning combination.

    The combination goes with an ad that has 50% roi with a prelander that has 180% roi and an offer with 95% roi. Currently putting it to the test to see how that goes.

    This caused my traffic to slowdown yesterday and no conversions at all, while today it has broke even till now. Curious to see how it will go on.
  18. Graybeard

    Graybeard Well-Known Member affiliate

    • The ad network <3 you :p
    • $200 is not a big loss but when you add up your time spent value?
    • I would try another ad network at this point
    • You have a merchantable offer that will convert -- you have established that
  19. Flaxy

    Flaxy Affiliate affiliate

    It is over 7 days so about $30 a day loss haha. I think I have found a winning combination (or at least the one who helped me did).

    Before the test I am getting closer to green roi every day. Had about 2 days green 2 red and 3 breakeven(with some conversions on hold that could push it to green).

    There was 1 lander which had like 80% of the rejected conversions.. Now that one is gone I think it should be better. Only testing the winning combination today or else I might revert some things.

    Do you mean traffic source or affiliate network that you would change?

    Do you know how long offers tend to stay? The data suggests that if I continue I should be having a green campaign within a week or 2.
  20. Graybeard

    Graybeard Well-Known Member affiliate

    The traffic source is marginal -- the offer seems good ...
    That is what I meant
  21. Louie V

    Louie V Affiliate Manager Affiliate Manager affiliate

    Nice! I loke it when there are posts like this one!