Domain Names & Keyword Matching

[Lunchbox]

Hey people, got a little question for ya...

When looking for a domain name for a UK market, is it best to get the keyword your looking to rank for as a .org.uk/.info or get a slightly longer domain name as a .co.uk/.com?

For example:

Lets say I wanted to get the domain to match the search term "dog training" (yes... an original choice for an example I know) and for example, the following domains are available:

dogtraining.org.uk
dogtraining.info
dog-training.co.uk
dogtraininguk.co.uk
dogtraininguk.com

Which one would you go for and why?

 

[moneytoplist]

I would register dog-training.co.uk - domain name with hyphen will get the benefit of keywords in the domain name. But if you target some long tail keywords I recommend to use no more than 1 or 2 hyphens in the domain name -- more hyphens may look spammy.

 

[Edwin]

I would go for DogTraining.co.uk as Google is very capable in identifying the two keywords "Dog" + "Training" and register Dog-Training.co.uk as well and redirect it to DogTraining.co.uk

domain name with hyphen will get the benefit of keywords in the domain name.

Without the hyphen as well, speaking from personal experiences.

 

[djbaxter]

When looking for a domain name for a UK market, is it best to get the keyword your looking to rank for as a .org.uk/.info or get a slightly longer domain name as a .co.uk/.com?

...
dogtraining.org.uk
dogtraining.info
dog-training.co.uk
dogtraininguk.co.uk
dogtraininguk.com

I would register dog-training.co.uk - domain name with hyphen will get the benefit of keywords in the domain name.

I would go for DogTraining.co.uk as Google is very capable in identifying the two keywords "Dog" + "Training" and register Dog-Training.co.uk as well and redirect it to DogTraining.co.uk ... Without the hyphen as well, speaking from personal experiences.

Actually, Matt Cutts had a blog post or video recently on this and hyphens do have an advantage over no hyphens. I think I posted it here somewhere - I'll try to locate it. What he said was that you should go for, in order of preference from best to worst:

1. dog-training
2. dog_training
3. dogtraining

The importance of the TLD (top level domain, i.e., co.uk vs. .com vs .org vs. .info) is primarily for the regional Google's so it depends on what sort of site and business you have and who you are targeting as customers.

.co.uk if you want to rank well in Google UK. .com if you don't care about the regional Google, because that has a recognizability factor and will help in the US market. There have been suggestions that search engines are biased against .info domains because they are cheap and therefore used frequently by spammers and fly-by-night webmasters. Other than that, the TLD really doesn't matter.

 

[djbaxter]

Here you go:

WordCamp 2007 talk: Whitehat SEO tips for bloggers
By Matt Cutts, Google
August 24, 2009

In Slide 9 from the 2007 WordCamp talk:

Keywords in url paths: domain.com/my-words

• Dashes are best
• Next best is underscores
• No spaces is worst

...more including video

 

[Edwin]

Hi Minstrel,

That would apply to URL paths, not to domains.

I've experienced personally what is described in this article.

In terms of advantages, I think this might be just the opposite for domains.

Pure speculation on my part, but I think that is because an exact match domain thus without the hyphen is often much harder if not impossible to obtain.

So it's less likely being used by a fly by night spammer, on the other hand domains with hyphens do.

 

[djbaxter]

No, I'm sorry, but I have to disagree. The example in that particular video may be for the path or filename but it also applies to domains.

If you read older pronouncements or statemetns about the issue, going back before say 2007 or 2005 or earlier, I think things were different. Look for example at comparisons of Google Caffeine with the old Google.

See:

Dashes vs. underscores

Matt Cutts of Google Says Still Go With Dashes in URLs

Proof Google Treats Underscores & Hyphens Differently?

http://www.amnavigator.com/blog/2009/10/24/to-hyphenate-or-not-to-hyphenate-a-domain-name/

Keyword domain - better with dashes or not

Google’s Treatment of Underscores vs Hyphens – The Confusion | Search Engine Journal

 

[gtvs]

Hey people, got a little question for ya...

When looking for a domain name for a UK market, is it best to get the keyword your looking to rank for as a .org.uk/.info or get a slightly longer domain name as a .co.uk/.com?

For example:

Lets say I wanted to get the domain to match the search term "dog training" (yes... an original choice for an example I know) and for example, the following domains are available:

dogtraining.org.uk
dogtraining.info
dog-training.co.uk
dogtraininguk.co.uk
dogtraininguk.com

Which one would you go for and why?

I would go for dog-training.co.uk because others are not really targeted to uk and if you use .org doesnt sit well, infact google recognise more the site names with dash (-) like yours dog-training.co.uk.... i think this is the best...

 

[Edwin]

The Matt Cutts blog post again is referring to file paths. (There are no underscores possible with domains)

Yes, he did also refer to a domain, but what he referred to is more the spam nature of using too many dashes in a domain, not that dashes are preferred over non hyphenated domains.

The two subsequent links apply again to URL paths, not domains.
The following link describes someone having more success with a non hyphenated domain.

The WMW thread goes into the theory Google can't process all that information to distinguish words in domains...an argument I've heard way too much before and I find completely irrelevant if I see exact match domains rank with ease.

Mind you competing results include authority sites with overwhelming more backlinks.

Then another link that is relevant to URL paths.

I'm sorry Minstel, but we'll have to agree with the fact we disagree on each others conceptions on exact keyword domains and associated advantages.

 

[djbaxter]

The Matt Cutts blog post again is referring to file paths. (There are no underscores possible with domains)

Yes, he did also refer to a domain, but what he referred to is more the spam nature of using too many dashes in a domain, not that dashes are preferred over non hyphenated domains.

Re: no underscores in domain names -> that's correct but that doesn't negate the superiority of dashes vs no dashes in the domain name.

And the comment by Cutts about using too many dashes in a domain name is included as a qualifier to his point that from an SEO standpoint dashes in the domain are superior, i.e., use dashes but don't go crazy with them or "you might draw (negative) attention for other reasons" (paraphrased). I think what he's saying there is pretty clear.

 

[Linda Buquet]

How about we agree to disagree on this one?

I think you've both made some really great points.

 

[Edwin]

Agreed!

 

[djbaxter]

Well, I was going to agree to disagree but now that Edwin has agreed I think I am honor bound to disagree with his agreement.

 

[Edwin]

One day I'll get you to agree with me.

 

[Lunchbox]

Thanks for the help guys, glad I've managed to spark a bit of debate.

From what I've gathered, the choice of domain name doesn't seem to matter all that much. I'm sure there are arguments for and against both but at the end of the day, if it's a crap site, it won't get far regardless of the domain name.

I think I'll just go with what feels right and spend more time on actually making a good site.

 

[lexdino]

dogtraining.org.uk
dogtraining.info
dog-training.co.uk
dogtraininguk.co.uk
dogtraininguk.com

Here is the order which I will rank them if I were you:

dogtraininguk.co.uk (best)
dogtraining.org.uk (better)
dogtraininguk.co.uk (good)
dogtraining.info (good but you aren't targeting UK with this domain)
dogtraininguk.com (confused)

 

[mla16]

if the site dogtraining.co.uk already existed, would you still look at dog-training.co.uk as a new niche website and try and take the competition on, or would you just look for something more unique??

 

[Lunchbox]

It would all depend on if I thought I could do a better job than the competition. If for example dogtraining.co.uk was unavailable but the site was nowhere to be found in Google or was there but on page 5 i'd give it a whirl. If the competition was strong (no matter what the domains were at the top) I'd reconsider and more than likely look elsewhere.

 

[Adammo]

Wish I saw this earlier. Some interesting points! If you use dashes, would keyword order matter?

For instance, let's say golf gear was a better SEO term than gear for golf. Since the words "gear" and "golf" are in both, would it matter?

i.e. golf-gear.com or gear-for-golf.com

 

[James Richardson]

Domain names

From what I have learned you want to pick a clean domain name based on what your keyword research has lead you to. Googles free keyword tool is a sufficient tool to use with SEO Quake.

So dogtraining.com would be the easiest to remember, and tell someone about. If you ever wanted to promote in the public a domain with no hyphens and a .com is the easiest to remember and type in.

You want your domain to have the keyword that you are targeting inside. Dog training is definitely highly competitive. SEO Quake will give you the page ranks of the pages on 1st page of major search engines.

Let me know what domain you choose, I will check it out.